Recently I stumbled across an older article entitled “Are Men Still Hunting?”. The author while an SJW feminist laments that men aren’t the aggressors anymore when it comes to approaching women. (She follows up here.) I saw some comments and added a cordial one of my own.
What stood out were comments strewn about how women were reaping what they’ve sown because of feminism and great pleasure was expressed about it. Okay that’s true as well as bits about how approaching can be easily construed as sexual harassment these days.
An overall glance of said comments prompted a realization; many of us are too busy reveling in womens laments and pain to care about doing anything to help. All we have is schadenfreude – and it appears to be a serious addiction. That’s only a few steps away from being a miser who loves miserly company.
Not surprisingly, it was the MGTOWS who here enjoying her lamentations the most. While one phase of the Red Pill is a justifiable anger and bitterness phase, I’m starting to notice a slew of men who don’t come out of it. Ever.
Instead of any meaningful self improvement and actually finding a girl they enjoy, their primary driving factor for happiness is the misery of women – feminists in particular. They are addicted to schadenfreude. This wasn’t quite the Red Pill you thought you swallowed.
“Maybe this makes me a sicko, but I get pleasure when women put themselves into predicaments.
My favorite is when a woman turns down every good man who pursues her only to throw herself at the man who is blatantly a scumbag. Then when the scumbag man mistreats her, she whines and cries about how “there are no good men out there” and “all men are jerks”. Instead of learning from her mistake, she blames men and then REPEATS THE CYCLE!
Back in my mangina days I would try to console those women and reassure these women that there are certainly good men out there. These days I don’t care. And in fact, I find it amusing.”
Okay, yea I get it. I loathe tumblr feminism as well and do my fair share of blasting self-entitled harpies on RVF boards. And yes, I do admit sometimes getting satisfaction seeing the worst offenders reap all of the venom they’ve sown – especially male feminist white knights. The anger? I understand feeling it the lies we were told as well as the women who rejected us for Chads and now are facing the consequences.
However, don’t you ever feel a sense of sadness for them? While they’ve bought into and advocate for an ideology which will make them miserable – and those around them, I often desire to apply actual burn ointment to their 1st degree roasted souls.
Obviously, the differeing worldviews make most online dialogue with them pointless, fruitless, and not worthy of your time. In spite of this when you come across posts like hers, try avoiding another, “haha bitch” type comment that burns as well as points out what feminism has wrought.
Instead maybe just try a semi-neutral heart felt internet hug. Will another comment debunking feminism change their mind and undo years of influence under a feminist worldview? No.
Here’s a question I would put plainly to them without snark: “What do you really want?” You’ll find most women do want to fall in love. Romance. Be swept off their feed by a studly chad. The truth hurts, but it can be presented with chocolates rather then a spear to the stomach. Honey for the flies instead of vinegar.
I find that when I’ve talked to feminists face-to-face, as well as women in general that are very discouraged with their dating prospect, an honest genuine heaping of advice can get past the normal “blockers” and at least onto the plate as food for thought. When a critique is done with kindness, the openness can be shocking. (Plus it helps that they know you have no romantic interest in them – in my case being married and all.)
The Effects of Misery
When women are miserable in particular, it deeply affects them and those around them. Perhaps they deserve it – especially the slut walkers – but do we look past what they deserve for a moment?
Being constantly in a state of war is exhausting – especially when the enemy is a never ending source of social media and blog posts that are filled with venom. Some rad fems may deserve to be burned by the fire they spew, but is mercy ever an option? I’d like to believe so. That Nietzsche quote about gazing into the monster seems to apply here.
Perhaps I’m mellowing a bit, but at a certain point I’d like to see relations between men and women improve wihout some sort of Mad Max like collapse of society – even if those in question aren’t worthy. The author in question might have better luck at a Friday Night Magic tournament where she is surrounded by lots of men and almost no women – so why not point it out?
We know many women who wish they were approached by men they would find attractive. For many it won’t happen. However, we can at least make suggestions to help them make the best of their chances and interactions without malice dripping from our fangs. (Especially if we know them.)
Who knows, maybe finding a guy they fall in love with might bring them out of their stupor. It has for many a woman. Maybe she and they can be one of them – certainly a good thing for culture and society.
Disclosure: I’ve recently talked a bit with Ben via digital means. He also points out that he does not identify as a feminist.
Ben was pierced for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. The punishment that brought us peace was on him, and by his wounds we are healed.
The vengeance for all of the cat-calls, all of the “creepy” men with their ingrained misogynistic awkwardness, and the sum of all “harassment” that they had ever experienced was visited upon Ben. His apology was scorned. These militant feminists; they know not what they do.
Or do they?
You terrible male cis shitlords, check your privilege.
It wasn’t until this week that I found out who Ben Schoen was. He is actually the the owner of Feminspire and what one would call an equality feminist – similar to that of Christina Hoff Summers. Arguably, he’s put a lot of time, effort, and resources into fighting the good feminist fight.
But, based on a series of interactions that certain feminists didn’t approve of, none of that mattered at all. Anything he had done to help women was all thrown out the window. Today in popular feminist online blogging and academic culture, the burden of the sinful male feminist is a tough, exhausting, un-rewarding, soul-sucking, and constant mandate to prove the support they have for their female feminist masters.
Ben’s mistake was one he was born with, one that all of us terrible male shitlords who breathe oppression suffer from on a daily basis – he is male.
This is the original sin of not just 3rd wave feminism, but of much of today’s social justice tripe that focuses on only your biology, while entirely ignoring your character.
The Entitled Interaction
Our story begins with a message to a Buzzfeed writer, Grace Spelman who decided to air all of their personal dirty laundry which started this twitter lynch mob – something that should surprise none of you. (Note that when I tweeted at Ben, she suddenly followed me then blocked me. I reciprocated the favor.)
Ben used to be involved in a Harry Potter fan podcast and she friended him on Facebook because of that podcast about eight years ago. Forward to present day and a certain site had an article on Grace’s twitter – or instagram – profile as one with 10k followers that people should check out.
Well, he did just that and realized he knew her. He then sent her several tweets, to which she didn’t respond. So he sent her a message though Facebook, one that I must admit while somewhat humorous was awkward. (Another reason why men should learn about Game.)
Then he moved to Facebook. I politely told him I was seeing someone and then blocked him on FB & Twitter pic.twitter.com/k84dCJ3OrT
Consider some of the gems Grace has written for Buzzfeed.
“30 Shirts For The Weirdos In Your Life” with the sub header, “Embrace Your Inner Weirdo”. Besides all the shirts apparently being made off Zazzle’s shirt maker in 30 seconds, that inner weirdo embrace definitely didn’t seem to apply to Ben.
18 Pickup Lines You Should Try Immediately” I particularly enjoyed “6. I noticed your arm grazed against my sweater. Pretty soft, huh? Go ahead, feel it. Do you know what it’s made of? Cashm-—CRAP, I mean, “boyfriend material.” I’m sorry. I’m really nervous.“
18 Sexts You’d Actually Love To Get. My personal favorite, “About to go through your Facebook and like all your profile pictures.” That’s not at all creepy and stalkerish that every male feminist should embrace…
Ben would then send her an apology though email, which would be the last contact he would have with her.
It was here that Ben made a crucial mistake; he apologized to this nasty harpy innocent glorious snowflake princess worthy of all admiration. His mistake is highlighted in Mike Cernovich’s excellent post, “How To Survive A Public Shaming” which I suggest you all read and thoroughly take to heart, because any of you male feminists – no matter how devoted to the cause – could become next.
What remains to be seen is why Grace felt compelled to publish the messages and emails, despite the apology. No, I’m joking. Never, ever, apologize to people like her. They don’t want an apology, they want blood.
They would get that blood when Spelman shared these conversations between them available to the ever controversy and outrage hungry feminist audience. (In all fairness, Ben did express his fustration on twitter before Spelman made these public.)
The Bleeding Frenzy
The timing of this was of course fantastic. It all happened right during the hashtag prominence of #ThingsFeminstMenHaveSaidToMe. A male villain to go with the tag had just presented himself and confirmation bias would strike a vicious blow with Ben as its target.
Eight hit pieces came within a matter of 72 hours from sites that all publish articles concerning Feminism and how it also care’s about men. I thought I was a terrible piece of sexist misogynistic male anti-feminist racist homophobic transphobic ableist trash, but I would have nothing on one of their own, namely Ben Schoen.
I didn’t even bother linking the hordes of other ones off blogs. I’d estimate there are over 100 different sites which covered his terrible misogynistic actions. These actions of his were of course so atrocious, that they make women cower in fear for their very lives every time they sneak a look at Twitter, read an email, or browse through Facebook in search of the powerful patriarchal oppressors who control every aspect of society.
These articles would direct thousands of tweets to Ben’s twitter, all telling him what a terrible misogynistic piece of shit he was. His tweets specifically were pointed out as tweet rape harassment as tweeting at someone must be a consensual activity governed by enthusiastic, clear, and concise verbal consent.
Feminist hurricane Spelman would continue to rage, but she would make one very interesting admission concerning why she didn’t accept the apology. This might not be as ideological driven on her part as I initially thought.
That angry mob spewing threats, harassment at Ben, and every other vicious form of Twitter rape at him was funny. I think we know who the real victim is here Scoob.
Yea, she found it funny, but the lynch mob angered over his vicious retaliatory responses to her “rejection” didn’t and they would continue to go after Ben.
This was all deliberately blown out of proportion for the sake of the cause – the unwilling martyrs of #ThingsFeministMenHaveSaidToMe – don’t matter.
The supposed sin that Ben committed was that he didn’t respond the “right” way – according to SJW feminist dogma- about how to handle his “rejection”. He was accused of the usual “male entitlement” when it comes to conversations with women. Observe the tactic from the NewYorkMag:
“The whole exchange is pretty emblematic of the inherent difficulties of rejecting men, both online and off. Women are frequently made to toe a line between being polite enough to not set off the suitor, but not so polite that their manners are interpreted as flirting.
“You can’t win in these types of situations,” Spelman told the Cut. “Even if you are polite in your rejection, they’ll demand that you tell them WHY you did it. It’s just a mixture of entitlement and the fragility of the ego … Because you don’t know how they’re going to handle it, you don’t know if you should be afraid or not.”
“I still am not quite sure if I should be scared of this guy or not,” she added.”
Considering who the mob’s pitchforks have been stabbing, I’d say Ben should be scared.
Now reverse the genders for a moment, and you will notice that this same concept of “entitlement” in regards to conversations between the genders is not applied. You will also notice a specific expectation – or dare we say entitlement – by feminist women as to how men should respond to “rejection” in conversations.
Who are the real entitled one’s here?
Rhetorical question, shitlord. Of course it’s us terrible male cis straight oppressors.
You will respond how they think you should, or you will be castigated with every “ist” and “ism” under the sun. They don’t care about the women and angry girlfriends in the thousands of YouTube videos who are destroying their ex’s car, home, possessions, and property. In fact, it’s considered funny. Humorous.
Now could Ben have initially handled it better?
Is it “harassment”?
No, not even close. But that’s the key tactic at play. If you can label this as harassment, Ben is a complete and utter shitlord, despite how ACTUAL interactions between men and women occur.
This is as much “harassment” as is Dish sending you two more additional letters asking if you would renew your Cable subscription with them.
Observe some of this BS
@GraceSpelman It reads like your typical sexual harassment case. Guy offers the promise of employment in exchange for fringe benefits.
You know what’s worse then being called a slut? Being called a creep. People at least want something from sluts. They prefer to completely avoid creeps. It’s not enough to shoot someone down, you have to label him in to practically an untouchable for his awkward approaches. That’s the kind of forgiving 3rd wave feminism encourages.
Think of what this entire situation implies to all male feminists out there.
Have an interest in a girl who is an ardent feminist and you are a male feminist?
Don’t bother. You are a manipulative oppressive betraying shitlord who is taking advantage of her trust placed in you as a worthless slave ally. In fact, expressing interest is harassment and a manifestation of Patriarchy, so back the hell away and check your privilege for the 1000th time today.
Obviously, you should wait for her to express interest in you, and if that never happens, too bad. Sit down, and shut up. Listen in silence like the slaves you are and make sure to kiss her shoes while you are bowing down, face to the ground.
The Disposable Cannon Fodder Ally
I ask myself, “How can one allow themselves to be treated with such disrespect and dehumanization?” Female feminists take their male allies for granted, that is why. They demand respect, but refuse to offer any in return.
Respect is earned, not given. Until male feminists realize this, they will be treated like dirt and disposable tampons for purely emotional use and support. Ben was then further accused of harassing her by threatening her job. Well, let’s look at what he said.
The so-called threat was Ben hinting that he was going to check Buzzfeed’s policies on the matter. Ben’s response:
Your article is printing a flat out lie. I never threatened her career. She started posting private emails and I said I would let her bosses know as that is against the policy of many media companies.
Of course, this was made out to be vicious harassment, despite the fact that companies like Buzzfeed have policies about not publishing people’s private emails and correspondence. As the infamous shitlord Vox Day has said, “SJWs always lie.”
Regarding his own employment, the mob would wish him well:
They literally blew up his private life, bringing up conflict between him and his ex-girlfriend who had been the co-partner of the site before he bought her out. His side of what happened in their relationship was irrelevant to their narrative.
Ben would go on a livestream with infamous and now Twitter banned Chuck Johnson to explain his side of the story.
During the interview Ben points out that he still identifies as a feminist – don’t ask me why he tortures himself. He did however make a key distiniction about it, “I am sincere about being a feminist when feminism truly means equality.”
Considering modern day feminism has nothing to with “equality” when men are the subject of conversation, that will happen when pigs fly across the English Channel.
Notice something else about these harpies; Both Ben and Chuck were attacked during their interview for their weight.
So much for Fat Acceptance.
While it’s amusing that they think grade-school like insults based on someone’s physical appearance will hurt them or their arguments, it highlights an internal inconsistency in the “fat is beautiful” crowd; the body positive image part of intersectionality -another faux cause feminism claims to advocate for – is subject specifically to the person in question.
If you don’t personally like them, that oppressive male shitlord should feel not only creepy, but ashamed of his overweight exterior which apparently is not very beautiful at all.
I have a question for you male feminists: Why do you let these small groups of malcontent harpies dictate no only how you should act, but how the rest of us of how should behave and respond in interactions between “insert marginalized/oppressed group here” and whoever else seems to rank lower in the progressive stack?
This whole fiasco and public shaming debacle is what happens to male feminists who are “Allies” and mess up – even slightly – regardless of their apologies. Yet woman like, Bahar Mustafa who writes #KillAllWhiteMen and bans certain people from diversity meetings because of their biology isn’t condemned or called out, but rather affirmed as an SJW of courage? She messed up that bad, and no lesser white feminists of note/faux journalists even called her out.
Speaking of her, shes actually Turkish. Turkey is a nation that has been oppressing everyone around it for over 500 years. Fun Fact: Talking about the Armenian genocide there is illegal, let alone acknowledging it, I consider her an oppressor whose privileged ancestors brutally murdered, oppressed, enslaved, subjugated, and genocided my ancestors for hundreds of years deeply and profoundly triggers me. Her ancestors are one of the primary reasons my ancestors have a hell of alot less today than they should have.
Back to you male feminists: You are considered scum of the earth by radical female feminists. Everyone else matter and needs a voice – except you. Your role is to listen and shutup. R.S. Mccain sums it up well, “Feminists who say their movement is about “equality” are lying. Feminism is a movement about power — absolute and unlimited power — and therefore the first rule for men in feminist movements is, SHUT UP. “
These man-haters aren’t even trying to hide it, in fact they are deliberately trying to make your life hell. Ever heard of Kafkatrapping? It’s a rather devious, sinister, and merciless tactic used to intimidate and bully “allies”.
“No matter how “nice” you are to a feminist, she will never respect you. The feminist always mistakes male kindness for weakness, and is incapable of gratitude toward males, so that being “nice” to her will only serve to convince her of how infinitely contemptible you are — a servile lackey, a fawning slave who appeals to her sadistic impulses.”
Here’s a confession: I’ve slept with two self-identifying feminists who were well aware of what I think about feminism and social justice. It didn’t matter. Ever wonder why they choose to sleep with “misogynistic sexist deuchebags” like myself instead of their male servants who think all the right things but aren’t ever seen as even the slightest romantic and/or sexual possibilities? (Of course being attractive, good at sex, in good shape, and having some game greatly helps, as it did in my case.)
The call-out culture these feminists in their Twitter lynch mob happily engage in as they target Ben is toxic. However, when fighting a war involving scorched earth – I mean men who have their lives and reputations deliberately destroyed to try to make them permanently unemployable (Yes, some women as well) – I encourage all of you to engage in like reciprocity of call-outs and shaming with feminists who throw the first punch.
Fight back. Stop calling yourself a feminist, because the movement isn’t just not about men, it despises them. There are men and women out there who actually care about you and want you to succeed and prosper as a man, despite the tripe and lies feminists spew about them.
“As feminists, we rightfully put the interests of women first, and we are sceptical of ostensibly feminist arguments that appeal to men’s interests.Solidarity should motivate the privileged in their struggle for change, not self interest; to make an analogy, it would be offensive and misguided to ask the black leaders of the Ferguson movement against police violence to tout the benefits of anti-racism to white people. Likewise, feminists should not be obliged to sell feminism to angry men.”
“But I would offer another analogy: when we combat fascism, it behooves us to offer an alternative to those that fascists would recruit. We may not be able to reach the most hateful misogynists, but feminists must directly attack the false ideology of men’s rights. We must offer a real answer for men consumed by anxiety, and especially those who feel a sense of sexual frustration.”
Avoid vicious women and men like this. Avoid people who label themselves as such feminists and constantly use social media to go after people’s jobs. They don’t care about you. They only care about your original sin- that you were born with the wrong set of genitals.
—— Grace Spelman has had her spotlight, online fame, and reputation boosted from this encounter from the internet trampling of Ben. Evidence of this and her hypocrisy will be exposed and documented in a later article.
Apparently country, metal, and hardcore shows can all be lumped into one large group of live shows that perpetuates a “War On Women. We now all know that the people who go to see Stick To Your Guns also go to see Carrie Underwood. Who would have thought?!?!
I strongly doubt our friend Amy Mccarthy has actually been to a hardcore or metal show, but it didn’t stop her from slandering the scene and equating the “dangers” there to something resembling the Congo. She mentioned posers in her article, and if there is one in the room, its not any of us. If her writing is any indication, she’s never been to the Warped Tour, to SXSW, Mayhem, Riot Fest, Chaos, ect.
This still doesn’t stop her from equating metal/hardcore shows with country and others to the point that she never bothers to really distinguish between them. It’s not incidental, its deliberate so that her article appears to encompass as many genres as possible. All shows are lumped into the “evil” category via guilt by association. Obviously, she has been to a country show, but she dishonestly tries to pretend that hardcore/metal shows present similar “dangers” of which will be covered soon in this piece.
Wow, I didn’t know only women could be terrified at shows, but who cares when the other gender gets hurt, right? (I’m only 5 foot 7!) Also, until Amy Mccarthy told us, I didnt know that girls who attend shows are fragile, scared, helpless, and frightened creatures who can’t think for themselves whatsoever. I’m glad I know this now though. I’ll be sure to tell my wife this.
Before I forget, obvious and continual shame on AltPress for promoting this hit-piece Pulitzer prize of inspirational journalism. Now she talks a big game, but lets look at some of the points she makes about metal and hardcore. She’s one of us – not a poser, groupie, ect – right?
“Most women who frequently attend live shows will tell you that they have been harassed, groped or assaulted as they listen to their favorite bands. A standing-room-only show, when you’re wedged into a massive crowd fueled by beer and testosterone, is particularly scary. There seems to be a spectrum of violence that women experience at live shows, ranging from misogynist verbal harassment to sexual assault.”
Notice her claim about “most women”. Well, if we want to accept her bizarre anecdotal claims, ask girls you know who go to live shows how often they have been harassed, groped, or assaulted. No, having your butt touched when crowd surfing doesn’t count. Neither does it when you are jumping up and down, moshing, that OTEP incident, or trying to get a better spot closer to the front.
“A standing room-only show.”
How many metal/hardcore shows have you been to where it has not been standing room only? Yea, that’s what I thought. Maybe she is referring to other genres, but she doesn’t bother to make that distinction. Accident or assassination? Our reputation lies in tatters. (Only exception I’ve experienced to this was Summerfest in Milwaukee when August Burns Red and The Devil Wears Prada played in which the stands cut down on much of the area available to stand and mosh.)
“Most important, though, the dangerous and unpredictable nature of concert culture means that it is often entirely unsafe to be a woman in a dark, crowded music venue.”
Anyone else get the idea that she hasn’t been to any metal/hardcore shows in a dark, crowded scary horror movie-like music venue? How many stories has ANYONE heard about someone actually being sexually assaulted – real sexual assault that is – or being raped at a show?
I’ve heard of some groping, butt touching, and other shenanigans, but that’s not rape – which is a serious matter.
“Even when the violence doesn’t escalate to the level of rape, unsolicited touching and aggressive come-ons from drunk musicians and fans alike is all too common.”
This isn’t at all subjective. Unsolicited touching. What the hell is that? Incidental contact made when crowdsurfing? Sweaty smelly bodies pressed together because of sold out show or the desire to get into the best spots in the venue or outdoor stage?
Consider when A Day To Remember played The Rave up in Milwaukee and it sold out. It was so damn packed that in no way could you not touch someone. If they were dripping sweat, you were going to be participating in it. But yea, I suppose there were thousands of incidents of unsolicited touching that happened there.
Drunk musicians and fans? That is very specific to certain festivals and shows. Most smaller shows don’t have that many people drinking, and for some its not even available. I.E, how many people actually drink at the Warped Tour? Consider the price of beer and if they are even of age and its pretty damn slim. Perhaps Country Thunder may be an exception.
“Venues can implement a number of procedures to make shows safer for women, like adding barricades to mosh pits and increasing security presence in the crowds, but it’s still difficult to control what happens in the middle of a frenzied show.”
“Adding barricades to moshpits.”
How exactly is that even possible – considering how, when, and where moshpits actually break out at show? They just organically happen. You would think she’s never even see a pit before Or been in one.
. Neither has she considered the fact that putting barricades around a pit would end up hurting people pushed out of the pit… This in particular flabbergasts me. Add “Fun Police” and moshpit killer to Amy Mccarthy’s resume.
Consider what happens when “security” is added to pits. They usually attempt to break them up, fights occur between moshers and security guards, and the show is often then usually stopped. Give it a few weeks, and you fight that yet another venue will no longer hold shows.
“In fact, they should be using their positions to outwardly do everything they can to ensure that these shows are safe for female concertgoers.”
The point of hardcore shows is that they are not safe specifically for anyone – including women. The aggression and danger is part of the reason people go. It’s not a Blake Shelton concert environment, and we shouldn’t pretend that it is. You can’t demand that the shows become made “safe” for a specific group and then get mad when people call them posers, because lets face it then; they wouldn’t actually want the same treatment as the rest of the “group” gets. If you go to a show to see The Acacia Strain and you get near the pit, people aren’t going to stop moshing or suddenly restrain themselves because you have to decided to enter the area – man, woman, or otherkin.
Well, you heard it from her. We need to show special care, treatment, and deference toward women at shows – because they might get hurt. I think Amy has a strong developed sense of female narcissism. Toss out that equality concept. Perhaps she should go to a Terror show and tell them how it needs to be a safer environment. I can’t help thinking, does she actually care about the safety of all concert-goer, or just women?
I’m five foot seven and I have to carefully consider what pits I go into and I have to be very aware of who is moshing to ensure I don’t take a punch to the face. Apparently, my safety doesn’t matter – unless I’m a woman. Then again, if I go to a show, I don’t expect the atmosphere and environment of the show to change just for me. You would think that Amy Mccarthy believes women are these weak creatures to be entirely helpless and completely unable to protect themselves. (Equality right?)
“As for the fans, well, it’s probably unrealistic to ask that they keep their hands to themselves and quietly enjoy the music. Ultimately, it is the artists who have the most responsibility and the greatest ability to ensure that the environment their music cultivates is not inherently aggressive toward women.”
Yes, its VERY unrealistic to ask fans not to mosh and to “keep their hands to themselves.” Any metal/hardcore artists that ensure an environment that is not aggressive isn’t going to be around very long.
Notice though that the aggression is fine, as long as its not toward women. Earlier, she quotes Lorena Cupcakes complaint, “Our motives are cast as disingenuous; we’re called groupies, posers, and hangers-on. Male dominance is established by questioning our right to be there at all.”
Well, this is why your motives are being questioned. You want to be there, but you don’t want to participate equally in the aggressive nature of the shows? You want the shows to be specifically made safe for you, but your not a “hanger-on?”
Amy mentioned earlier in the article that, “Depending on the genre you enjoy, male fans who share your interests might call you a “poser,” or insinuate that you’re not as punk or metal or hip-hop (or as whatever) as you claim to be.” Labeling an environment like a hardcore show as being aggressive toward women, makes it easier to call women “posers” who participate, because instead of being treated the same as any other guy, you show them special treatment.
The irony is that shows are filled with men who literally white-knight for women all around. Plenty are nice of enough to stand in front of them and shield them from the pit, taking those windmills to the face because equality. Or helping them to safety when the pit really starts to get going during a The Acacia Strain set. Girls will tell you tons of stories like this. Oh wait, I forgot. Women are weak, helpless, can’t think for themselves, or even enjoy a show!
Personally, I’m a bit more of an asshole and a true equality feminist. Unless I know a girl, and she gets near the pit, I’m not shielding her body with mine – cause equality. She’s not a poser, she can take – just like me or any other guy – right. On the flip-side, guys usually care if they hurt a girl in the pit. They don’t however if you are a guy – your size doesn’t matter.
“Other times it involves being forcefully shoved across a raging mosh pit by someone three times your size, or being touched inappropriately as you try to crowd-surf. These may seem like harmless little interactions, something that should just be expected in a rowdy crowd.”
For once, know your pits. This applies to literally everyone at the show, regardless of whatever Tumblr gender identity you have that day. I’m a smaller guy, so I have to pick when and where I go in, especially when the breakdown hits. I doubt she has ever experienced one. For two, “women being pushed into moshpits”. If you are standing near to where a pit suddenly breaks out – that could be anywhere, especially at larger shows – everyone gets either pushed into the new pit or pushed back out of it, something she isn’t aware of. I smell a rat Scoob.
Notice how she talked about crowd surfing. It’s pretty damn near impossible not to have your butt touched as you are getting passed toward the stage – or getting your wallet stolen if its in your back pocket.
Surprisingly, Amy actually talks to an “expert” that gets it:
“Metal expert and weekend editor of VICE’s Noisey, Kim Kelly, is particularly used to being banged up at the end of a show. “If I’m at a death metal show or a DIY thrash show in a basement, I know things are gonna get crazy, bottles are gonna fly, and I’m probably going to come home with a few bruises,” she says. “I’ve always been able to hold my own, but women who are smaller or less brash than I am might absolutely feel intimidated by the testosterone-fueled violence. In my experience, if you don’t want to get hurt, you stand in the back or on the side, and keep your guard up.”
I find it humorous that someone – girls specifically – are going to feel intimidated by testosterone-fueled violence. Consider the amount of places left that you can actually let out your aggression and feel the testosterone coursing through your veins is pretty slim. Metal/hardcore shows are about all that’s left.
Hardcore shows are probably the only place where its part of the show. It should be obvious, but feminists types like Amy want to curb our outbursts of toxic masculinity at our last remaining refuges where they aren’t shunned, but are actually embraced – a sense of community if you will.
When we get upset and speak out about the nonsense, outright lies, falsehoods, and the tripe she spews, we are then of course proving exactly her point – that metal/hardcore aren’t safe spaces and places for women and that we are all terrible misogynists. Yea, well fuck her. Maybe eventually, she will name one of these many survivors who has ever been “raped” in this epidemic at the Warped tour. Or Chaos. Or SXSW. Or Mayhem. Or any of the hundreds of others.
“It doesn’t seem like too much to ask that the women who are just as much a part of these respective scenes — we buy just as many records, concert tickets, and band T-shirts as men, and are equally supportive of our favorite acts – not feel physically intimidated when they’re out at shows. In New York’s hardcore scene, bands like the recently reunited Kill Your Idols make it a point to cultivate “positive mental attitude” at their shows and address inequities in their scene, proving that it is possible for these safe spaces to exist without compromising the rowdy vibe that is expected of hardcore punk.”
At hardcore shows…
In New York’s hardcore scene…
Yea, she just said that. Based on everything she has said in this article, she doesn’t want to just kill off the rowdy vibe, she wants to salt the earth after she’s buried the corpse. She wants to eliminate it and replace it with a safe space that doesn’t wreak of sweaty testosterone misogynistic fueled aggression. Mccarthy believes that women are too fragile to be exposed to anything that involves… testosterone.
You would think she would know this, but the entire point of a hardcore show – especially in Boston, LA, and New York is to let yourself go in the pit and at the show. Don’t expect “special” and “safe” treatment. If you want to roll with the guys, expect to be treated like anyone else in the show – especially if you go into the pit.
“Until we address the systemic issues that drive this violence, though, like rape culture and the nonsensical idea that women have to somehow “earn” their place as legitimate music fans, it is likely that even that wouldn’t be enough to make live music a safe and positive experience for women. Still, hearty encouragement from the acts onstage and the venues that host them would be a really helpful start”
What was that about posers? Groupies? Disingenuous?
Oh, that’s what safe-space demanding Amy Mccarthy thinks women are. In fact, if we created safe spaces and destroyed New York’s Hardcore scene by turning those triggering mosh-pits into seats filled with male zombies gazing unmoving and silent at the stage, it still wouldn’t be enough.
Don’t give into people like Amy Mccarthy. If they are unhappy with their scene, they will go after yours, and attempt to kill it if they can’t be as happy as anyone else. This is the worse form of narcissism – the take-no prisoners kind. You know why people hate feminism? It’s because of women like Amy who demand that everything revolves around them and hell with everyone else.
Oh and just in case you actually like Country and think she might be over blowing things, a commenter on Salon called out at least two of the examples which weren’t exactly true – if not outright lies:
While not attempting to minimize or dismiss any of the legitimate complaints of women who have been assaulted or otherwise abused, at least two of the examples provided are flat out false:
1) Tim McGraw was not grabbed “on the leg” — he was grabbed *on the crotch* and rightfully and justifiably responded by hitting the woman who sexually assaulted him. Had the sexes been reversed, would you offer that up as an example of mistreatment? I doubt it.
2) The “rape” at the Keith Urban gig at Great Woods was not a rape. The charges were dropped because it was a consensual act. The claim of the young woman was not that it was not consensual, but that she didn’t really want to have done it — and that’s a distinction worth making. Its the difference between things happening without your consent, and things happening with your consent that you wish you hadn’t agreed to do. Huge difference, with massive implications for the other person involved, and definitely needs to be paid attention do.
Oh, also Amy Mccarthy: Don’t talk shit about metal and hardcore shows, until you’ve been to plenty of them.
I had the fortune of finding an article posted about 4 weeks ago on “We Hunted The Mammoth” in which the sites owner and noted male feminist – David Futrelle – promoted an article on The New Statesmen about how liberating men sexually would bring about an end to the problems women face concerning sexism.
Liberation usually sounds like a phenomenal idea. Well, what kind of liberation is the the author – a dominatrix by trade named Margaret Corvid – talking about?
Let’s get started. There are plenty of anticipated attacks on MRA’s, the manosphere, and the ever present Patriarchy. Before we go any further, she makes a very important point about feminism and how it relates to men.
“As feminists, we rightfully put the interests of women first, and we are skeptical of ostensibly feminist arguments that appeal to men’s interests.”
Straight from the horses mouth. It’s statements like this that should convince anyone with a pair of testicles that any men’s issues the feminist movement claims to advocate for are at most lip service. When it comes to the lip service, she barely even does that with her suggested feminist skepticism of anything that appeals to “men’s interests.”
The sexual liberation she talks about later will specifically not appeal to the interest of most men in the general population. Throughout this piece she implies, but never explicit states this idea that men should be vulnerable during sex. However, the kind of vulnerability she refers to is that of men being dominated or “penetrated”.
“He is allowed to penetrate, but not to be penetrated; to control, but not to surrender; to enjoy the grace, sensuality, and sex appeal of a woman, but never to wish to express these traits himself.”
Okay, fine. What disturbs me is that she continually suggests that men who don’t enjoy or being dominated are somehow suppressing their full sexuality. Perhaps its not fear preventing an embrace of this kind of sexuality, but rather a majority of men who really don’t want anything put up their ass.
Even now, what feminism asks of men – that they be conscious of their privilege and respect the agency of women – can lead them to truly satisfying intimate relationships.
Notice how she mentions that being aware of privilege and “respecting the agency of women” whatever that actually means and/or exactly how one goes about that somehow equates to satisfying intimate relationships.
Think about that. Since when has checking, being aware, and acknowledging, one’s privilege automatically translated to successful intimacy in relationships? Acknowledging your male privilege isn’t going to get your wife or girl-friend to put out more. It’s not going to land you any dates.
In fact, I would suggest that “privileged” checking in front of women for well intentioned reasons of modern SJWs communicate a lack of confidence and assertiveness. It is the equivalent of undermining yourself – which essentially destroys your chances of landing that date.
Later she makes a similar claim in the ending to this piece:
“For men, a true feminism offers liberation and sexual fulfillment, through the very process of coming to a fuller understanding of their privileges, and burdens, under patriarchy. “
Quite an assumption. Again, how? Having a full and thorough understanding of your burdens doesn’t translate to liberation and/or sexual fulfillment.
“We may not be able to reach the most hateful misogynists, but feminists must directly attack the false ideology of men’s rights. We must offer a real answer for men consumed by anxiety, and especially those who feel a sense of sexual frustration.“
Yet again, I don’t think the answer to sexual frustration for many men is being dominated and/or having things shoved up their ass. Being dominated by a dominatrix might appeal to a small segment of the male population, but what about the rest of us?
“It is feminism that offers men the chance at a sexually fulfilling life. When rape culture is extinguished, when patriarchy subsides, all genders can realize their full sexual expression in safety.”
Checking our privilege and patriarchal burdens doesn’t seem to give us a clear picture and game-plan for improving our sex lives if it doesn’t involve anal penetration by a foreign object. Being forced to rain in our “toxic masculinity” in concern to our sexuality as feminism demands also doesn’t seem to sound like a fulfilling proposition.
I’ll make a brave and shocking assertion; a fulfilling sex life for men can’t be achieved by concentrating specifically on the issues of women and ignoring those of men which today’s radical feminists seem to do quite often.
We are often told in life that many things are “bad”. Some are obvious – theft, rape, murder, ect. Others such as “cat-calling” are not. I ran into this article on XoJane in which this smoking hot babe was catcalled. Determined to do something about it, she confronted every last one of them. Either there were only 3 encounters worth mentioning, or she was only catcalled three times – group encounter for one of those – in a week.
Something that kept popping up in my mind: Why actually is catcalling bad? Most men – and I use that concept sparingly – know that it often doesn’t work, hence it usually is employed as more of a “I’m messing with you” kind of interaction. Well these days, almost any kind of interaction can become undesirable, offensive, and even become capable of being defined as harassment.
Catcalling has been a bullet point for most of today’s modern first-world feminists. We know they don’t like it, but they never have really set up a “doctrinal statement” with all the trimmings as to why catcalling is offensive. (1) “I’m offended”, is not an actual valid argument. Why should we care? Just to get the cycle rolling, perhaps we are offended that they are offended. (2) Just because certain women are offended by it does not actually make it offensive. (3) Interactions that make you uncomfortable aren’t inherently wrong.
Her main “argument” against catcalling seemed to be that it makes women feel afraid:
How can you explain to a stranger that a compliment makes us feel afraid? That words like gorgeous and beautiful sound like threats when we hear them whispered to us on an empty street late at night? That we feel uneasy, objectified, and uncomfortable when you say this to us while we’re going about our normal routine, not asking to be judged on our appearance out loud? That this thing they do for fun is at the expense of our peace of mind?
So if something makes someone afraid, we shouldn’t say it? Where exactly is the line drawn? So what if it causes fear? What if this women actually causes fear just by the sound of her voice?
That’s not a quick chat you can have with a stranger on a street corner. It needs to be part of a bigger conversation, earlier on, by the people who are in charge of shaping you into a respectable human. When we’re being taught as young women not to respond to this kind of attention, we need to also be teaching our young men not to engage in this behavior in the first place.
Until she and the rest of these radical 3rd wave feminists provide a thorough methodology as well as a strong philosophical foundation for why young men shouldn’t cat call, we should ignore and dismiss her demands as illogical and irrational. In fact, I’ve talked to girls who claim they like and enjoy cat-calling. While it is a somewhat mundane form of validation, why should I encourage others to acquiesce to the demands of this writer vs these other girls I’ve talked to? It’s also not just the ladies I’ve talked to but ladies online, including self-identifying feminists. Decisions, decisions.
I very much dislike in today’s polarized and vitriolic climate. I also take issue with the constant refusal and automatic dismissal of people based on what they identify with as well as the labels others give them – yes that includes radical feminists and all other “labels” I disprove of. We should never become these irate walking narcissists who will only associate with others who think as we do. However, we must be careful as well.
In the end, if a woman confronts you about “catcalling” its an immediate, glaring, and vibrant red flag that you should ignore her and refuse to converse with her any further. Walk away, and if she refuses to stop following you, threaten to call the police. The chances are high she could be a radical feminists who has a score to settle with the male half of our species and defining your words as “harassment” is her logical next step. When you run into the Jezebels of the world, it’s best to avoid them, or face their wrath in which the ends always justify the means.
The more and more I see posts by feminists – particularly the radfems- there appears to be this vitriolic disdain for the penultimate height of evil that infests our world; the ever dangerous white male.
Many of the things said about these “white males” are deemed acceptable statements of “uncomfortable truth” though one would not dare utter similar things about anyone else who either wasn’t white and/or male. Society is full of double-standards which we usually make excuses for with concepts like Standpoint Theory (Privilege) and the notion that if you are supposedly a member of the opposing group in society, you can’t be oppressed, marginalized, disadvantaged, ect. no matter if you are a homeless “white male” on the streets in Chicago’s terrifying winters or not.
A clip from The Amazing Athiest on “Tumblr Feminists” sums up the self-loathing that white males are supposed to feel at all times:
In a feminist’s world, I suppose it’s a good thing I’m only half-white so I experience just a little bit less hate and vitriol.